Listen to our newest podcast episode where we discuss the opportunities and difficulties in working with family and friends, Secure Act 2.0, and couples sharing their finances. The full transcription is below or you can follow this link to listen.
Untucked Episode 77
Meghan Tait: [00:00:00] Welcome to episode 77 of Untucked. This is Megan and Mike. This is Jeff. Happy New Year.
Mike Traynor: Happy New Year. Can’t say Happy New Year after January 7th.
Jeff Mastronardo: I say it through like March.
Meghan Tait: Oh, January 7th. Yeah, that was okay. March is like, absolutely.
Mike Traynor: I think that was a curb your enthusiasm. . Okay. It’s ism.
Meghan Tait: It’s so funny you say this because someone said Happy New Year to Steven, and he said that, and I hadn’t even made this connection.
He was like, Mike would know that
Um, but I feel like these is the first time we’re talking to these people.
Mike Traynor: One, what if we didn’t do our first pod till February for somebody? It’s
Jeff Mastronardo: a happy new year for me then. Yes.
Meghan Tait: Uh, maybe I wouldn’t have gone Happy New Year. I probably would’ve gone. first one of 2023. .
Jeff Mastronardo: That’s so, okay. Yeah. Doesn’t, you might as well say Happy New Year.
Meghan Tait: New Year. Same fun facts.
Jeff Mastronardo: Four seconds. [00:01:00] Four seconds is the appropriate amount of time to Dunkin Oreo in milk. It’s not a fact. It can’t be a fact. It is no. if you’re, if you assume the cookie eater is looking for a thoroughly dunked cookie, but not a damp Oreo, four seconds.
Meghan Tait: It’s not a fact. , we’re starting off the year not strong.
Mike Traynor: Yeah, I knew Mike with a fun opinion. I have a, I have a fun fact rebuttal if. I
Jeff Mastronardo: have a backup, but go ahead, let Mike’s, it would prefer the revival, I think for 2023. Maybe Mike does the fun fact. No.
Meghan Tait: What I think we should do is you both come prepared and then I decide which one is who’s is better.
Jeff Mastronardo: Fun. All right.
Mike Traynor: Okay. Did you know ?
Jeff Mastronardo: He loves it. I think he should do, is this Oreo
Meghan Tait: related? No, no, no, no. Oh. Oh,
Mike Traynor: okay. [00:02:00] Joe. Th man’s actual name is Joe Th. . Interesting. He was encouraged to change it, to be pronounced Theisman. Why do you think? Because he was an
Jeff Mastronardo: attractive guy back then. Theisman? For the Heisman. Oh, gotcha. Oh,
Meghan Tait: mm-hmm.
Wow. Heisman campaign. Mm-hmm. . So it’s actu, but like nothing about his name changed. Well, the
Jeff Mastronardo: pronunciation, it’s just a variation. It’s like tomato, tomato.
Mike Traynor: Or it’d be like if Megan came in one day and. I’m Megan Tiet. Call me Tiet.
Jeff Mastronardo: So
Meghan Tait: yes, like, just like
Jeff Mastronardo: that. . I think it’s that, that’s not fact either. That’s just opinion.
It’s pronunciation opinion. He, he
Mike Traynor: was probably, what, 19 years of his life, he was Joe Eastman. I don’t buy
Jeff Mastronardo: it. I think, I think you’re,
Meghan Tait: we’re arguing. We’re not comparing that to the Oreo. I
Jeff Mastronardo: think it’s the same thing. . All
Meghan Tait: right. All right guys. , [00:03:00]
Jeff Mastronardo: that’s interesting. Mike. Thank you for sharing. Sure. Anytime.
Meghan Tait: Um, all right, well, I guess we’ll go.
Birds clench the number one seed home field NFC goes through. pretty good result, right? Oh,
Mike Traynor: Jeff, how you feeling? They’re not exactly rolling into the playoffs. That, that
Jeff Mastronardo: doesn’t bother me. I don’t, I don’t follow that storyline whatsoever. Mm-hmm. , like all week, the last two days, three days, , they’ve been complaining about how Jalen Hertz didn’t run the ball.
They had no predetermined like run plays for him. Like he didn’t look great. He was slid. and I, I just can’t believe they’re short of this much entertainment value. Like obviously the coaches said, look, man, slide, don’t run the ball. Don’t kill yourself. And if you play it like 30% capacity, you’re gonna beat their backups.
So just do that. [00:04:00] And that’s exactly what he did. And I’m also not buying how injured he is, you’re saying. Oh, like Nick Sirian. He’s like, he’s banged up. Like it’s, he’s in a lot of pain. I’m not buying that at all. I think they’re just, they’re trying to make people think that he’s more injured than he is my opinion.
I could be completely, that’s a take. Um, there’s a lot of chatter about, you know, they’ve been off, like they haven’t looked so great. They’re not gonna be able to turn it. and play at playoff level. Do they do that every year? They have the pre-season and then they’re expected week one to show up and be in game shape and play like at your highest level?
I think it’s exactly what’s gonna happen. Whoever they play, Dallas, Tampa Bay, I think they’re gonna blow them out in Philly.
Meghan Tait: I’m definitely more optimistic than everybody. Everybody else seems to be, and by everybody it like generally like talk radio people. I agree. I mean, I think the playoffs are a completely [00:05:00] different season, and if they were playing their best football now, I’d be probably cool with that too.
But they’re here, they, they clinch the one seed. They, they did everything they were supposed to do. So I don’t really see any reason not to be optimistic. Everyone’s banged up like every team. Players who are hurt at this stage of the game. So it’s just who has enough healthy players who can make enough good plays to win games.
Either they don’t need to be pretty at this point. They just gotta get wins.
Jeff Mastronardo: Yeah. And if Jaylen’s banged up, we’re going into every game as it’s, it’s as if it’s his last game in the season. Yeah. , like there’s no, hey, Jalen next Sunday. Like, there’s no, you know, just take it easy on the shoulder. We’re not gonna run you, we’re not gonna throw the ball like deep because you know, we wanna save you for the Super Bowl that doesn’t exist.
Right, right. Look, if he goes out and hurts himself weak, you know, first round of the playoffs, so be it. Right. You, you played a win that game. Yeah. [00:06:00] I don’t care how they. , the how, how they won, you know, the, the one seed in the nfc? Yeah. Like, it doesn’t matter to me if they stumbled into it or if they dominated into it, they’re in the same position that we wanted ’em to be in.
Mike Traynor: Yeah. I’m, I’m, I’m up. I mean, hey, first round buy is huge. Mm-hmm. , no matter how you slice it, home field is huge. So, and they’re gonna get their first game against a way inferior team.
Jeff Mastronardo: Yeah. So an inferior team that plays Monday night. Yeah. Mm-hmm. , we’re gonna have 15 days off, they’re gonna have five mm. I think it’s, it’s, it, it lines us up.
We and I, I can’t believe they, they made the schedule that way. Mm-hmm. , where the bye team plays a team that played on Monday and then turns around and plays on Sunday. It’s so unfair.
Meghan Tait: Not this year. It’s not , . If if we, if the Eagles were in that game, yeah. Oh my god. People would be pissed. Pissed.
Jeff Mastronardo: But [00:07:00]
Mike Traynor: you going.
Jeff Mastronardo: Maybe.
Meghan Tait: Possibly. Nice. Yeah. We’ll see. That’ll be fun. It will be. I mean, and I don’t, I, I’m saying maybe like of course it’ll be fun. It’s just, I met my quota of Eagles games like three games ago, so . Yeah.
Jeff Mastronardo: We’ll see. I’m optimistic. I hope that the two weeks allows the guys who are nicked. Yeah, to to be able to play for three hours at a level that’s competitive.
Like Lane Johnson specifically? Yeah. Like I know he’s got a very touchy injury when you talk about groin or oblique or abdominal tear. Like they don’t heal quickly and they’re painful. They could probably get him to feel okay for a timeframe. But
Meghan Tait: Mike and I are looking at each other laughing cuz I think if today’s Wednesday, it was Monday, you were sitting here saying that’s fine.
Right. Like [00:08:00] he’ll be fine in a couple days. Right. It’s not that bad. ,
Jeff Mastronardo: I still feel the same way. Like he’s going to have two weeks off and they’re gonna, they’re, they’re going to dope ’em up on whatever they need to, to get him to feel okay for three hours. And that’s all I care about. And then we’ll, we’ll reassess at the end of that game.
Look, did he tear it worse and he can’t go the following week or what? All I care about is the next week. Yeah, I’m with you. Cool. Your boy. dropping 36 in 26 last night. Yeah. He’s playing
Meghan Tait: out of his mind right now.
Jeff Mastronardo: Didn’t like the braid. Look he had. No, everybody loved it. I, I didn’t,
Meghan Tait: yeah. I’m, I’m not, I’m not opposed.
I mean, it’s just different. It’s much different. He’s never worn his hair.
Jeff Mastronardo: He’s just head looks so much smaller now. Joelle dropped 36 points and he only played like 26 minutes last night. They blew the pistons out by like 30. Yeah, like the entire and. What was impressive was it’s a team they should [00:09:00] destroy.
They destroyed them. They scored 42 in the third quarter, which is typically their band quarter. Worst quarter. Yeah, they look good. Yeah, they look like they’re
Meghan Tait: clicking. Yeah. I wanna say that’s like. 13 of their last, like 16 or 17. I mean, they’ve been playing really well. They’re fourth or fifth in the east, I think.
Um, at this point Joe’s been kind of in and out of the lineup. He’s been dealing with some, they’re calling it foot soreness. Uh, no one’s really elaborated as to whether or not it’s worse than that. Um, part of me thinks it’s just kind. Minutes, they’re rolling without him. So if you don’t have to have him playing as much, great.
Although it makes his, um, kind of ranking in like season accolades, it diminishes that, which part of me doesn’t care. But then part of me cares, like the way the dude’s playing. He should legitimately be in the MVP conversation, but it’s [00:10:00] always gonna come back to whether or not he played enough. Um, that’s neither here nor there right now, though.
Yeah, it’s, I mean, they’ve been, they’ve been fun to watch and like aside from Joe Harden’s getting healthy Max, he’s back and healthy and they’re definitely clicking. So I think
Jeff Mastronardo: there’s a noticeable difference between those three playing together this year than last year.
Meghan Tait: Yeah, I think that’s fair.
Jeff Mastronardo: And I didn’t think it was possible for Maxie to look better.
Meghan Tait: He just looks better with James Hart, like when he doesn’t have to run the point. And James, Ken, and he can kind of be his like explosive off the ball, off the wing guy. I mean, it just, it bodes well for everybody. Him certainly, but then their offense specifically, it just gets them going and running and, and James has been doing that and last year, you know, he was, he was hurt.
I mean, it, it [00:11:00] matters when you have a point guard of his age, like not being able to kind of push the offense the way it can. and we’re seeing that version of him a little bit. And I mean, he’s been playing awesome too. I mean, his stats like, um, shooting assists. I mean, he’s, he’s not like Houston James Harden, but he’s probably the best version we get at this stage in his career.
Um, . So, yeah, I mean, I, I don’t wanna like be too excited because they’re the Sixers, but it’s, it’s fun to watch right now. They’re fun to watch right now. Yeah.
Mike Traynor: All right. Yeah, it’s okay. I believe everything you said, , I don’t know
Jeff Mastronardo: it, but talk to us about the,
Meghan Tait: uh, fly guys might be the opposite. .
Mike Traynor: They’re just, uh, languishing in sub mediocrity.
They’re not like in the running for the first overall pick, which is kind of a shame. . He’s a legit, legit stud. Um, there’s just a [00:12:00] handful of teams that are, believe it or not, worse than them, and they will be worse at the end. The flyers are gonna win enough games to kind of be in that, you know, five, 500 at best.
10 games under 500 probably is more in line, which puts them in a ti, you know, probably a 8, 9, 10 draft
Jeff Mastronardo: pick. Draft purgatory. Draft purgatory, where
Mike Traynor: they always. and I think probably they’ll finally deal some guys at the trade deadline that are, that a couple years ago we would’ve said no way, like a pro of, um, maybe a connect knee might be like guys that were seen as building blocks to build around that are valuable assets.
And that would, that would in indicate capitulation where the organization is, is not lying anymore and saying, we’re gonna be competitive. We have to, um, you know, build up some prospects and draft picks and, and young [00:13:00] potentially good players, which also
Jeff Mastronardo: sucks.
Meghan Tait: Trust the process as they say. Yeah. ,
Jeff Mastronardo: it’s worked so well for still
Mike Traynor: watching ’em.
I love, I mean, I’m not gonna not watch them, but Yeah. But, uh, they’re, they’re, they’re not a playoff team, but they’re not bad enough to be picking up like a g. . Great. 18 year old. Next, next
Jeff Mastronardo: May. Surprisingly, I don’t think they’re as unwatchable this year as they were last year. I think they’re playing above our expectations.
Like, like Ella I think is getting more out of these guys than Than they were getting last year.
Mike Traynor: Yeah. Yeah. And some of the young guys like Tippit and Kate’s, I like, they’re impressive. They’re probably gonna be pretty good players. , they’re just not good enough. Up and down the lineup. Yeah, that’s it. And then, you know, th this backup goalie that’s played a few games is, looks like really, really good.
So [00:14:00] now it’s like, hmm. Well there’s two good goalies here, one of which is an asset, so not very exciting. I mean, I’m surprised to hear you Jeff even say that cuz I don’t think you, I didn’t think you watched any flyers.
Jeff Mastronardo: No, but I have wa what I’ve tuned into, like they’ve looked better than I re like what I watched last year.
Last year I’d watched a game and I’m like, I can’t even watch it. I agree with that. They were so bad. Yeah. They couldn’t get outta their zone at all. They couldn’t get outta their zone. They couldn’t, they, it was just bad, bad hockey at the professional level. And I don’t feel that way when I, when I, when I’ve watched this year.
Meghan Tait: All. . Good on Philly sports?
Jeff Mastronardo: I guess so. Oh,
Meghan Tait: do we have to go into Philly’s? I don’t. I didn’t know there was anything else. . I have nothing. Oh, thank God. . All right, well, before you think of something, let’s get into Coach’s Corner. So what we wanted to talk about today is, um, , you know, maybe some of the opportunities or some of the [00:15:00] difficulties in doing what we do.
So providing financial advice to our friends and family members, whether it’s they ask for it or maybe we’re listening to a conversation and, you know, feel as though we can help. Um, like how we kind of navigate those types of conversations. I’m all
Jeff Mastronardo: over the map with this. Yeah. I mean, I’ve been doing this long enough where I have enough experience where, , I was the advisor to my best friend’s parents.
That did not go well from the standpoint of like, I don’t even know. I think they, because they trusted me so much, I don’t know how much they even listened to what I was saying. And then when the shit hit the fan in the market, they bailed. Um, and I’ve had friends of mine who’ve been clients for like 20 years and it’s been a great relationship.
We’ve been able, , you know, not really go through any major headaches that kind of infringed on our [00:16:00] friendship. Um, and I don’t have, obviously other friends and family members that are clients. Um, and it hasn’t affected any of the normal like, Relationship that I have with that, those
Meghan Tait: people, were most of those solicited by you or none?
Jeff Mastronardo: None of them were solicited by me.
Meghan Tait: Right. So your approach in that, thinking of it that way has always been they come to
Jeff Mastronardo: you. I would never do it the other way. Yeah. Uh, for the mo, like, I don’t, I don’t, I mean, I, I don’t think I’ve ever, except for like when I first started Yeah. In the business, the, the person that hired me, , sit down with everyone, you know, and the approach was, which I thought was a decent approach.
You were obviously looking for business, but it was like, no one’s gonna do business with you because you don’t have any experience in this field, but just explain to them what you’re doing. Yeah. And some may have questions and maybe you can help or you can bring it, uh, an a more seasoned [00:17:00] person in to help you with it.
And also as time goes on, like they’re gonna remember. Okay. That’s what you do for a living. Yeah. . That’s the only time I’ve solicited people. Mm-hmm. in
Mike Traynor: my network. Yeah. I mean, I think on this issue, there’s two, to me, there’s two aspects to it. One is the, and I, and I think of it more than just financial, let’s say financial advisory people.
I think of doctors and realtors in the same category in that there are, you know, there’s opportunities for people to hire a friend of theirs as a doctor, for example. A realtor or a financial advisor. And I think there’s two, two prongs to it that I think are factors. One is the nature of the information is private and confidential, and some people just won’t get past the, the requirement to divulge that stuff to a friend.
Right. Um, and I think that’s real for some people. Um, the other [00:18:00] aspect I think is that the possibility that something goes awry on the business relationship side of. And they don’t want that potential to compromise a friendship. I know for a fact it’s happened with, um, my wife who’s a realtor, where friends of ours have deliberately sought out someone they don’t even know, rather than use her because they just didn’t wanna risk blowing up a friendship if something went wrong in the business transaction side.
Um, and maybe a realtor’s not as, um, you know, Apropo an example, but, uh, I think it is.
Jeff Mastronardo: Mm-hmm. , I lose out on that house because Pam screwed something up. It’s absolutely no matter how benign going to effect, I believe the relationship.
Meghan Tait: Yeah. At least initially. Maybe not forever, but there’s gonna be a, an initial like
Jeff Mastronardo: strain.
I think there’s always gonna be that, like doubt in the back of your mind or just feeling like they’re not as good as. They really think they [00:19:00] are, they, they talk about, or, or how they present themselves.
Mike Traynor: Yeah. And so, but, but on that issue of the, the doubt or the fear of something going wrong or somebody being reluctant to share information that’s private and, you know, sensitive, whatever you want to call it.
I think that in our, in our world though, um, automatic and inherent trust factor that is already there, maybe overrides that for a lot of people like you, you’re not worrying about whether I’m like, I’m, I’m working with somebody who’s who I don’t trust. You’re right. Or who might screw me, or, um, I’m not really sure if they’re, um, they’re competent or something like that.
I think that that should and couldn’t at times, like override any reluctance to do it, uh, to do business with somebody they know for those other. . Does that make
Jeff Mastronardo: sense?
Meghan Tait: Yeah. Yeah. I also feel like with us, it’s like if, if someone’s seeking financial advice, whether [00:20:00] it’s from their friend or a complete stranger, like in order to get good advice, you’re gonna have to disclose information.
Mm-hmm. like the fact that it’s a friend, you know, it, it maybe changes, it maybe creates some apprehension around doing it. , would you rather do that with someone you trust, right, or go to a complete stranger and then have to do and disclose and share the same kind of information?
Jeff Mastronardo: I think there is a lot of apprehension around sharing your information with people you know, even though you trust them.
I think that the client may feel like you would divulge some of that inform. to other people in your circle? That’s, see,
Meghan Tait: I, I’ve never even, yeah, I don’t even consider that. Think about that. I always think of it as like that person, so if someone shares information with me, like I’m judging them in some way, right?
Like I’m being critical or judgemental of how they spend their money or [00:21:00] how little they have in savings or like how much they do or don’t make. That’s what I’ve always felt to be. the concern, not that I would sh have that information and then share it with like, our mutual friends or, or connections.
Jeff Mastronardo: I, I’m sure, I’m sure both of that exists.
Yeah. Like I’ll, I’ll take like my brother-in-law and my sister-in-law, for example, Melissa’s sister, uh, sister and her husband, they have said for years they can probably like, you know, we should probably use an advisor. We should probably call Jeff. They never have, which I’m totally fine with. Mm-hmm. . But I would guarantee you that there’s definitely some feeling of what you just said.
Oh, well, now that he knows we have that much money, and I’m making this up. Right. I have no idea. Now that we know, he knows that we have that, uh, is he gonna judge us because we didn’t put in on that house to go down the shore together or, yeah, but I, what is he gonna tell Melissa? Like, uh, like what we’ve done, like, I guarantee you there’s now whether that’s founded or not, which obviously it’s not like we treat our practice in, in confidentiality, just like doctors do.
Like you [00:22:00] cannot share that information with anyone. Yeah. It just doesn’t happen. Yeah. , but I guarantee you there’s some of that feeling there. For sure. You’re smiling, Mike, you’re
Mike Traynor: No, because I, I, I, at first I said that’s not even, and, and I’m remembering that it’s exactly a, a scenario that happened where a friend of mine’s in-law, mother, father, whatever the reluctance was just that, that it, the informa, any information would ultimately get back to the, to.
Direct friends. Right. Which of course, as you say, it would never, but, um, that was, that was a real thing.
Jeff Mastronardo: Yeah. I met with someone that knew my father, and my father knew I met with him, dude, like one of the first questions my dad asked, how much money does he have? My dad, I, I, I can’t tell you that dad. Yeah.
Oh. But like, you know, like, is it like a million, a couple million? I’m. . Yeah. I can’t tell you that information. Like yeah, you’re just gonna have to like, go to your grave not knowing, I’m [00:23:00] sorry, , or you can ask him yourself, right? Like, right. So I, I, I think there’s a lot of that. Yeah. Um, which I understand. I mean, I get, but you gotta, you’re, you’re gonna have to divulge that information to someone.
Right. And in today’s, six degrees of Kevin Bacon, like I’m sure, like some, like they may know that stranger probably knows somebody that you know, man.
Meghan Tait: Right. Yeah. It’s, it’s an interesting place to be in because even if someone doesn’t directly ask you for advice, right, you’re like, there’s, there’s conversation scenarios that that occur where.
Oh, Meg, like, what do you think? Or, oh, Jeff, Mike, what do you guys think? And you don’t wanna be the super salesy, like, oh well like it, that’s exactly what we do. We can help you like solve that problem , you know? But it’s also like kinda like that approach, Mike, that was good, but you, but you also wanna kind of remind people that like, that’s literally what I do for Jo.
And not because [00:24:00] you have to come to me for the advice. ,
Mike Traynor: but also I think the answer is like, listen, if you think I’m gonna Suze Orman you right with the answer. I’m not doing it right. Like, I, I can’t give you the answer to some generic question that applies specifically to you without knowing anything more about
Jeff Mastronardo: you.
Right. Of other information. Yeah. I’m, I’m like, I’m obviously, you both know me. I’m a very open person. I don’t like, I would, I am all on. With like, like I had a neck issue years ago. I called my buddy I graduated mal with, he’s not a neurosurgeon, but if he was, he’s the guy I’m going to see. Yeah. And cause I trust him and, and it’s, it’s, it’s 100% I know this person, they’re a friend of mine.
I believe they’re going to give me good information and information in my best interest and that is above all to me. I need to stop with. He’s an orthopedic surgeon, so like if I do see him, I’m be like, Hey dude, like my knee and I need to stop that because I don’t want to do it that way. I’d rather like [00:25:00] schedule an appointment and go to your office, Derek, and sit in your office and have you get compensated for giving me that advice.
Yeah, and I don’t want it in any other way. I don’t want you to gimme a discount. I want your service the way you charge for it. Yeah. He referred me to a neurosur and I had more faith in that neurosurgeon because he was like, look, if there’s something wrong with my neck, that’s the guy I’m gonna go see.
Yeah. So I’m, I’m, it, it doesn’t ma like you’re gonna find out how much you’re gonna ask me how much I drink. You’re gonna ask me like, what kind of medication I take. I’m an open book man. Cause I just, I value that trust and, and I just, I’m, I guess I’m such a cynic and I, I am so. Skeptical of every professional I come across that if I know someone in the business that is a friend of mine, that’s the person I want to use.
Mike Traynor: that’s fair. Yeah, I think that’s a good, good summation well put. Before
Meghan Tait: we wrap up Coach’s Corner, we just wanna add a couple of quick points [00:26:00] on the Secure Act. Uh, that was passed at the end of last year. There was some modifications to. The current way of doing things that we thought were worth highlighting.
They’ve increased the required minimum distribution age from 72 to 73, beginning in 2023,
Jeff Mastronardo: and then in 2033 it jumps to 75.
Meghan Tait: You can now roll over. balances in 5 29, plans up to $35,000 to a Roth ira. So
Jeff Mastronardo: if my kid doesn’t use all of their 5 29 that’s in my name with them as the beneficiary, I can take 35 grand of that balance and it rolls into a Roth I IRA for them.
Yes. I’m not on it. It’s, it’s literally it. It was my. that I was gonna use for their college and now becomes
Meghan Tait: their money. Correct. There are some particulars Sure. About the allowances of it, but yes, generally [00:27:00] speaking, that’s pretty cooling. That’s how it worked. Yes. Um, there’s some modifications to qualified plans.
They’re creating an emergency savings account, which will allow employers to establish accounts that are similar, um, to kind of Roth style investments, which will allow, um, assuming. We can assume employees to contribute up to 2,500 bucks for savings that they can access, um, for emergencies. Um, and then there’s, uh, changes in.
Some of the 10% penalty distributions, um, you’re able to access up to a thousand dollars penalty free from 401ks or IRAs. Um, whereas before there’s been a lot of restrictions around around doing that. Along the same lines of the minimum distributions, the penalty for not taking an RMD used to be 50.
It’s being reduced to [00:28:00] 25%, which is big
Jeff Mastronardo: still. High.
Meghan Tait: Yeah, but I mean, cutting in half’s pretty significant. Um, yeah, we found a just a like 16 bullet, one pager that we’ll share in the, in the details of the episode. Any others that you guys wanna point out? I think that’s good. . So we’ll move on. The next topic we’re gonna discuss is from the podcast I will Teach You to Be Rich.
Um, a podcast from Raymond Satie. Uh, he also wrote a book. He’s the author of the book, I Will Teach You To Be Rich. Um, his podcast is, uh, available I guess on. Wherever you can find them. But we watched the YouTube video, um, during which he interviews Nate and Serena, who are in their late twenties and engaged.
Serena makes 80 grand a year, and Nate makes $45,000 a year as a resident, so um, will soon be a doctor. [00:29:00] The interview discusses their money habits individually and as a couple the convers. Starts, um, with them talking about a trip. They plan to see Serena’s family, which Serena paid for and expects to be reimbursed, but evolves to their shared expenses and the differences in how they view sharing their finances.
So we thought the topic of sharing expenses, splitting expenses with a significant other was worthy of discussion. Yeah,
Mike Traynor: and I think that the example which Jeff and. instantly disagreed on was the, the hypothetical of a engaged couple who live together, make disparate incomes and are quibbling over whether they should share the rent or, or proportionally share the rent.
Right? Yep. So my take on that is, are you kidding me? Rent is not charged based on your income. Rent is based on the living. [00:30:00] If you, if you share it, you split it. I don’t care if I make 10 times amount or split it in
Meghan Tait: half. And you’re saying split it equally. 50 50 plus they’re
Mike Traynor: fiances. That’s, that’s even more of a reason to be like, why are we, are we seriously gonna like, sharpen the pencil here guys and, and say like, uh, you know, you owe three times as much as I do for rent because you make three
Jeff Mastronardo: times as much as I do.
What if they rent a house in Florida for a. And it’s five grand. They split a 2,500. 2,500. Yes. I can’t, I I couldn’t disagree with you more. And I have like multiple examples that there’s no way you can still feel the same way, way you feel. We have clients, what if they’re not Okay, go ahead. Sorry. That have like one, like they’re a married couple, recently married.
One has more money than the other, one has more income than the. and they’re splitting expenses down the middle, and one of them can barely make the payments. In fact is running out [00:31:00] of money to make the payments. Mm-hmm. , so that should be split down the middle. O okay. I, let me clarify. , that’s just one ex. I got another one for you.
Mike Traynor: me clarify. In that example, I totally agree with you. If one of the, the, one of the two in the, in the example has no savings or no cash and they can’t pay for that 5,000. Whatever rental, of course it’s gonna be, it’s gonna be paid for by the, the one that has the, the financial resources
Jeff Mastronardo: to do it. Okay.
So there’s a, there’s a line f monetarily where you agree. So like, if they had a baby and they weren’t married yet and she’s staying home taking care of the baby and he’s making $300,000 a year, they, they’re, he’s gonna pay the rent. She doesn’t have to come up with her half.
Mike Traynor: Let me, let me, I guess, again, clarify further , this, this hypothetical suggests that there is a split of the rent according to their incomes.
I agree with that a hundred percent. That, that I could not [00:32:00] disagree with more. It’s the rent would be, in this case, paid based on who has the money to pay it. They’re, they’re engaged. They’re not just roommate. Like, this is what I can’t understand. Like you, it’s your fiance and the rent’s gonna be paid out of one or maybe both, but probably just one person’s account.
Isn’t it all going to the same
Jeff Mastronardo: place? So are you agreeing with me or are you disagreeing with me? I’m, I’m,
Mike Traynor: you’re losing it. I’m disagreeing because I’m, I, in my mind, this whole thing is okay. She makes twice as much as I do the rents a thousand. You gotta write a check for six 60 and I write a check for
Jeff Mastronardo: 330.
Absolutely. Why wouldn’t you do it that way? I would say, okay, we live together. What are all of our, um, like joint expenses, utilities, um, maybe I’d throw the, our cars in the mix. Uh, rent, Netflix, Hulu, like I’d add it all up. It’s four grand a month, babe. You make 90. I make [00:33:00] 40. . So you’re gonna chip in three, I’m gonna chip in, or whatever the math breaks out.
Absolutely. I’ll put a thousand bucks in a joint account. You put three and then pay the bills. Like if I owned a home. If you owned your home and then you got engaged and you were, you were making your monthly mortgage payment and then you got engaged, you wouldn’t ask Pam for half of it. You would probably just keep paying the mortgage.
Of course, most likely. This is talking about. They live in an apartment together. Right. The rent is X. Right. And because she makes and, and, and they’re split, like their incomes are different. Right. Exactly. What’s So they’re paying the same amount of money towards the rent, which doesn’t make any sense to me.
Why would they do that? My,
Mike Traynor: my argument is, why wouldn’t I have gone to Pam and said, you owe money for rent this month? I just wrote a check. , like why are we getting to this, like splitting everything based on, um, I guess I’m hung up on the fiance part of it. I, I mean, if they’re roommates,
Jeff Mastronardo: [00:34:00] yeah, roommates is a different story.
A different story. Totally. This is a
Mike Traynor: fiance situation,
Meghan Tait: but I don’t think, I think that it’s, it’s, it’s happening a little bit differently now. People don’t combine finances maybe as early, um, maybe not at all. I mean, we see it now more probably than ever that like people maintain their finances separately, so joint expenses aren’t, The responsibility of one person.
It’s this place we live in together, these groceries we eat together, these utilities that we assume together are split.
Mike Traynor: So you basically go, you take showers that are twice as long as mine. ? No, the water bill is on you.
Meghan Tait: No, no, it’s, that’s getting a little too bad. We used, that’s the X amount of water. No. . I, I guess it’s it.
We’re, we have to, yes, they’re engaged, but we have to assume that they’re not at a place where it all comes from one pot just yet. [00:35:00] They may eventually be there, and then to your point, it’s like I cover rent. You get the, the bills when we go out to eat, like it all evens out in some form or fashion. We’re not, you know, keeping track of it.
But we have to assume, I think in this scenario that finances are. Com combined or commingled to the extent where like, everything’s one pot.
Jeff Mastronardo: If I was engaged today and I started living with my, my fiance, if I didn’t pay for everything, that was like, like when I got my, when I got engaged, I was in my own home, right?
And I, and when she moved in, I didn’t charge. For Pico for, but if my fiance and I moved into a place together, yes, today, I would most likely say, okay, what are our joint expenses per month? Okay, I make X. You make Y proportionately let’s each [00:36:00] chip in this amount to this account to pay those bills. Yes.
That’s how I would handle it. I would agree. Say don’t divvy it right in half. I don’t care how much you make. I don’t care how much I make. And then we’ll pay those joint expenses, which is what you’re.
Mike Traynor: Basing things on income to me is nonsensical.
Meghan Tait: How else would you do it though? Like to d to do it equally?
Like what if there’s a huge disparity in income, then are you forced? Is the person who makes more money forced to live a lifestyle that like they don’t want to,
Mike Traynor: they are subsidizing the other person because they are engaged.
Meghan Tait: We agree. We we’re agreeing with that. We want to subsidize if somebody makes more money, subsidize the person who
Mike Traynor: doesn’t, but don’t charge them anything.
Don’t charge them. Because if, if it’s ten one, but
Meghan Tait: if it’s, but what if it’s not? What if it’s not that egregious? What if it’s 80 to 45? Yeah. Like what if it’s 50 and 80 and it’s like combined our hundred and, you know, thir, what is that [00:37:00] math? One 30, a hundred , what did we say? 80 and 50? $130,000 like can afford.
A fairly nice apartment and like the ability to go and do nice things, but if we’re living on $50,000 a year’s budget, we can’t do any of those things.
Mike Traynor: So I, the, the whole thing here, not to belabor this, this is, this whole argument is based on whether you are assuming that going forward finances will be split or versus co-mingled and in.
Small head. I’m just assuming they’re co-mingled. And so what are we doing? Right? So you guys are arguing that they’re since going forward and indefinitely there’s gonna be his money and her money.
Jeff Mastronardo: No, I’m, I’m, I’m actually the opposite dude then. Then why I’m
Mike Traynor: co-mingling then why
Jeff Mastronardo: are you doing this? Their money is co-mingled.
Their incomes are obviously separate. Right. They have separate incomes always
Meghan Tait: will be. Right, right. This to me, Makes a lot of sense because it allows both of us to contribute to the extent that we can afford to, [00:38:00] and then most of the shit that we want to do together that’s more expensive, whomever makes more money, will be contributing more to those things.
Jeff Mastronardo: Sounds like you have some thinking to do much . No, I mean, .
Meghan Tait: I’m kidding. I’m kidding. The, the thing about this particular circumstance too that like was interesting was. . She, she wanted to go to visit her family, I think lived in Korea or whatever, and they, it’s an expensive trip. She paid for her fiance to go.
She like lent him $3,000 and part of their disagreement throughout the episode was him not being able to pay her back in a fashion in. She wanted to be reimbursed like as quickly. So that I think is, to your point, Mike, I don’t agree with that. Like far too nitpicky if that, maybe that’s the right word.
[00:39:00] Yeah. Um, so I’m in agreement that there’s a line that can absolutely be crossed to making this way more complicated and difficult. And in the case of this couple, like straining. than it needs to be. But I guess if we’re talking about just kind of ordinary every month living expenses, I imagine that both people want to feel as though they contribute an amount that they feel like they can afford to, and that in most cases is not gonna be 50 50.
Jeff Mastronardo: Yeah. Like I understand your point. Like Hulu doesn’t care how much you make. They charge whatever they charge, right? Right. The service is an income. , right? Mm-hmm. , to your point. Mm-hmm. , like nobody cares how much money you make. The bills are what they are, but if the person making more money wants to live in a 3,500 square foot home and the person making less money can’t afford to live in [00:40:00] that home, but that’s where they’re gonna go.
You can’t expect the person making less money to be able to contribute. Exactly. if it’s kind of unaffordable for them, if the person who makes more money wants to be in that, they’re gonna have to pay more. So that as a couple we can be
Mike Traynor: there. I think it, it’s a larger discussion, which we’ve had before, which is some people commingle everything.
Yeah. And I’m talking about like not a engaged couple in an apartment and talking about, you know, marry people or other people have allowance systems where they put a certain amount of money in their spouse’s account every month and that’s theirs. And then they. Work it that way. And, um, there’s a lot of different systems and I mean, something works for different people obviously, but
Jeff Mastronardo: it’s messy.
Yeah. No matter how you do it, I’m tell like it’s messy.
Mike Traynor: Well, I don’t know that it’s, my, my opinion is that if you just have it all in, and this is my opinion, I’m not saying it’s right, but it works for some people, which is you make financial decisions joint. Based on [00:41:00] the everything that the two, that the couple has, affordability or not, it doesn’t mean that you’re, you’re starting to have arguments about, well, I make X and you make Y, so I’m making this decision or, Um, I, I, I don’t know.
I, it’s just very, very foreign to me what this whole discussion, it just is .
Meghan Tait: I think it’s also though, like this couple is engaged, they’re not yet married. This is probably a really good time for them to like hash this shit out because you’re right, like everybody views their own money differently.
They’ve, they view the way other people manage their money differently. Yeah. So I, I, I think over time couples develop systems that. That work well for them. And the couple in this particular episode had the girl who felt as though, despite that she’s making more than her fiance now, she kept saying, he’s going to be a doctor, he’s going to make more money than me.
Like [00:42:00] eventually I’m gonna be the one making less in this relationship. Like she, she has a lot of emotional attachment to like, who makes more, not even, it doesn’t even sound like the dollar amount, but just. Making more or less than her partner. So like there’s a lot of deep-rooted things that like, we are not prepared to kind of, you know, dive into.
I, I think the point of this was just how interesting it is, how people choose to split money or not, um, in early stages of relationships, in long-term relationships and kind of everything in between
Jeff Mastronardo: when you’re in that established relationship or you know, yeah. Whether you’re married or not. I believe the two people sit down, they look at the household income that comes in and they make a decision about where that income goes.
Exactly what Mike just said from the standpoint of like, look, this is like we’re gonna pay these bills, you’re gonna save this in your 401k. I’m gonna save this in our Roth, and the total [00:43:00] 120 is gonna be at zero at the end of the year because we put X here, there, and everywhere. And I think that’s the discussion that should be.
that everybody, and, and whether your like 40, like 10,000 of your 40,000 goes to pay bills, but 20,000 of your 40,000 goes into our savings account. Doesn’t matter. Cause it’s all one big pot. Right. Is I, is the way I think it should be done, which I think is what you’re saying is well, yeah, I think I agree
Meghan Tait: with that and I think people get there eventually.
I just don’t. , everybody starts there. No, and there’s a lot of people just come from a place of what’s mine is mine. I want to contribute and feel like, again, everyone’s equitably and fairly contributing, but not to the extent where. You know, maybe I feel like I’m being taken advantage of or I have to overs, subsidize, or supplement.
Yeah. Like it
Jeff Mastronardo: just gets messy cuz you come into these relationships, right. With your own stuff. Right. Right. And then like I get married and my wife has a car payment and student loans and then we [00:44:00] have kids and now she’s not working so. I don’t expect her to pay the car payment and student loan. Right. So as a family we were like, okay, I’ll, I’ll, I’ll pay those.
Right? And then they, once she starts working again, she never starts paying them again. , which is a slippery
Meghan Tait: slope. Yeah, this sounds a little bit, A little bit personal. . All right. So we’ll just jump right into the top five, top five things. I don’t give a damn about that. A lot of other people. Yeah. Cool. Who wants
Jeff Mastronardo: to start?
I’ll go ahead. All right. Kanye West. I don’t give a damn about Kanye West. Like if he fell off the planet. Yeah, I would like, it wouldn’t even, it wouldn’t even phase me like, oh, Kanye West Funnel fell off the planet. Okay, , can I get a medium,
Mike Traynor: uh, dunk? If we’re going through individual people, there’s, there’s, there’s top 5 million.
Yeah. Yeah. You know, so I stayed away from individuals. He
Jeff Mastronardo: just, he stuck out and looks as I’m. Um, politics. I, I, I don’t [00:45:00] give a damn about politics. I really, I mean, I sh I know I should, I just, I don’t give a damn about ’em. I knew you were gonna say that one. I, I did your eye, or was that your teeth disappointed?
I thought you came around. No, I haven’t. I tried and, and I, and I on politics. Yeah. I just don’t came around. No, not really, but , um, , any of the Real Housewives shows? Oh, I had that one. Did you
Meghan Tait: really? I mean, I just had reality TV
Jeff Mastronardo: generally. Okay. But mine’s specific to the, like the real Housewives of wherever.
I don’t know. I can’t, it’s unwatchable. Mm-hmm. , I, I, I don’t give a damn about any of those people. Mm-hmm. Facebook. I don’t give a damn about Facebook. I hate it. Don’t give it an ambi. Okay. Any family that exists to like have a YouTube. , the YouTube channel families. I, I, I don’t give a damn about them at all.
I’ve never heard of them or seen. Oh my God. Really? Like, give me an example. I don’t, I don’t live on YouTube. I guess you have kids who, yeah. I, I can’t, [00:46:00] I don’t even know the names of my kids are like, oh, look at what, like Charlie and Johnny did to them. I’m like, oh, I, I don’t give a damn about Charlie and Johnny
Okay. Yeah, that’s my five. That’s your five.
Mike Traynor: All right. I can soko. All right. Um, college football.
Jeff Mastronardo: Wow. I agree with you 100%. I
Mike Traynor: absolutely would not have a shred of interest in watching like a BCS championship game of matter who any bowl game. Wow. I could not care less. And um, that’s a good, you guys probably thought I was gonna say baseball or basketball, but, but as you know,
Meghan Tait: right.
You have stipulations,
Mike Traynor: you know, conference finals or mm-hmm. ,
Jeff Mastronardo: you’re in.
Meghan Tait: I’m in. But like, you didn’t watch the national championship game on Monday? Nope.
Jeff Mastronardo: Nope. What about, I mean, you’re, you’re a Gamecocks guy now. Yeah. You’ve
Meghan Tait: like attended
Jeff Mastronardo: games this year. You have like stickers on your car. , but I’m,
Mike Traynor: I’m, I’m not there for the
Jeff Mastronardo: college football.
Yeah. I thought you were kind of into that. Oh yeah, you came in chirping a couple Mondays about Oh, didn’t see the game Cos on Saturday, , [00:47:00] they pulled out a big win.
Meghan Tait: Yeah, I don’t recall that
Jeff Mastronardo: at all. It was tall snake, whoever they play. I tried. I agree with you a hundred percent. I, yeah, that’s a good one. I hate Couch,
Mike Traynor: um, MMA and anything related to,
Jeff Mastronardo: oh, Mike, that’s a good one.
Mike Traynor: That’s a really good one. Yeah. Anything related to MMA or mm-hmm. . Mm-hmm. , that, that whole thing. Mm-hmm. . Um, next I have. cars. There’s car people, car guys. I could not care less about cars. Mm-hmm. , just
Meghan Tait: in general. I mean, I don’t know. I feel like you care a little bit about your Jeep.
Jeff Mastronardo: Such a guy who had like a crossover suv.
Audi. Yeah, but
Mike Traynor: I You don’t, I I don’t, I’m not a car person, like
Jeff Mastronardo: whatsoever. All right, so somebody gives you like a. Uh, like you’re not driving that anymore. Now you’re driving like a Kia Sorento, you’re like, whatever. It gets me to A to B, I’m good. That’s
Mike Traynor: not my point. There’s car people, like you have your Jay Lenos and people like that, that are like, or the [00:48:00] gearheads that are so into like, fixing up cars and cars.
Okay. That’s a different, okay. Whatever, you know. Um, I won’t call you out on it. Next. I. casinos slash gambling. I have
Jeff Mastronardo: interesting
Meghan Tait: guys. There’s so much overlap. So much overlap.
Jeff Mastronardo: I
Mike Traynor: have a couple. I cannot not you, you can just keep ’em, you can have all of that. Have it. I just, you know, say no more. And then finally, Oscar, Grammy’s, Tony’s, golden Globes, all of that.
Jeff Mastronardo: Good one. Another good one. That’s a really good one. Most
Mike Traynor: people love that. And, um, man, don’t give a damn.
Jeff Mastronardo: Yeah. I’m like, I’m like five for five on yours. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Meghan Tait: What do you got? Okay, so I had gambling. Um, I also had, I mean I had reality TV generally, so all of it different, whether it’s Real Housewives, whether it’s Bachelorette Love is Blind.
Yeah. The Bachelor, I mean, could not care less about Big Brother. Nope. No, I, I don’t, I don’t even know the premise of half the shows, like especially at the comp, those ones. No, [00:49:00] no. Not Naked and Afraid.
Jeff Mastronardo: No
Meghan Tait: Survivor? Nope.
Jeff Mastronardo: Okay, so all re reality .
Meghan Tait: Exactly what I said. Yeah. Gotcha. Yes. Gotcha. Game of Thrones. Ah, that’s a great one.
Could never, will never. And like you don’t know, you don’t know what you’re talking about. I mean, just, yeah. You know, have you even watched it? Because I don’t give a damn about it. If you watched
Jeff Mastronardo: it, you’d give a damn about it. I’ve
Meghan Tait: tried. I’ve tried. You’re lying. No, I’ve tried. Um,
Jeff Mastronardo: shame on you and you, Mike.
Meghan Tait: the royal family. Good one. That’s really good. Like, and I feel like it’s very polarizing right now cause of whatever is happening with whatever his face, but it, it wouldn’t matter, like if all of them fell off the face of the earth. If Buckingham Palace just like evaporated, cool. It’s just another day.
Gotcha. And then expensive wine. That’s a really good one. Like I’m in a place [00:50:00] where I like what I like. 20 bucks is the max. You give me something more than that. I can’t tell the difference.
Jeff Mastronardo: It’s really good. So like, this is, this is fantastic. It’s, it’s $150 a bottle and I’m like, it tastes like,
Meghan Tait: Decoy. Yeah.
It tastes like the McMurray that I buy once a week at the liquor store once a week. I think you might be overdoing anything. . That’s a lot. So that was five, right? Yeah.
Jeff Mastronardo: Yeah. Did, did you throw in a few backups or, or,
Meghan Tait: I had, um, . I had the Kardashians, but they kind of fi, I feel like they fall into reality TV a bit.
Um, I had Facebook, which you said, and then I had Will Ferrell, but because we weren’t doing individuals that’s not
Jeff Mastronardo: nice. .
Meghan Tait: Yeah. Everybody loves him. I just not a big fan. Did you guys see the musical he did with Ryan Reynolds? It’s on like Apple tv. It was like a Christmas, no.
Jeff Mastronardo: Horrible cringe. Really?
Meghan Tait: Oh my [00:51:00] god.
Maybe the worst thing I’ve watched, I watched in 2022, so it just
Jeff Mastronardo: reinforced your feeling
Meghan Tait: for Will. Oh, 1000000% . And it made me just like Ryan Reynolds, who I don’t have beef with. Yeah. Up until that point, I didn’t this. Wow. Yeah.
Jeff Mastronardo: Deadpool not a fan
Meghan Tait: anymore. Love Deadpool. Hated whatever this thing was called.
Alright. All good? Yeah. Yep. Thanks for listening. See
Jeff Mastronardo: you.